We just got our new 40 meter pump just over a week ago. The tally of working days are on the jobsite 3 day compared to 5 days at the mack dealership. Truck has been towed three times now. The reason for the trips to the dealer is that the truck wont regenerate it self. It also was into two mack dealers on the trip to ontario from bc. Just wondering if anyone else had the same problem with the new 2008 mac trucks. The new design of the truck isnt to bad. But its the same thing its still a mac.

I personly think you should order your new pump on a AutoCar. Great guys and a great product.

The reason for the trips to the dealer is that the truck won't regenerate it self.

Please tell me what that means

In order to control exhaust emissions, engine manuafacturers are now (as of 2007 emission engines) relying on a "DPF" which is a diesel particulate filter. This is trapping soot and particle emissions within a maze of porous media within a special expensive muffler. When enough "plugging" of this media takes place various sensor readings and computer program logic decide to regenerate. In Macks smaller MP7 case this is done by injecting fuel directly into the muffler with air blast to start up a fire to "clean her up".

The reason there hasn't been much news of performance of these "EMCON" systems is that there are not that many out there (vast pre-buy of dirty engines keeping an otherwise down market rolling along for the time being). Word has it that none of the MP7's actually regenerate properly. That might be because of an excess of electronics for this system that far exceeds what the lunar landing module had on board. Also, the term "poisoning"  relates to the death of this filter, when that happens up to 3G comes out of the pocket book.

My mechanics intuition tells me we haven't begun to see the range of possible difficulties as approaching 2010 targets will introduce another host of "Urea" technology to Mack, and amazing but non functional electronic trinkets to keep tow trucks busy.

For all you Cummins fans out there, the good news is that they work and have very few moving emission components.

Like there were not already way too many

reasons to NOT BUY A MACK TRUCK -

pow - they come up with another reason.

What are CAT & Cummins doing about this?

Some day, in about 1 1/2 years, people will

be once again standing in a line to buy a

new concrete pump. ********

which makes me wonder; what are the

crane companies required to do about the

engines in their truck cranes? Are they

held to a different standard?

PERHAPS THE PUMPING INDUSTRY NEEDS

A DEDICATED PUMP CARRIER

NOT

A TRUCK THAT (OH BY THE WAY)

CARRIES A PUMP????

better call volvo and pitch a bitch this is not any standard from a quality company

Eugene,

I don't understand your post.

I think that this is all very interesting, and I know how important it is to our industry. The post from 'Johny' was very informative. I hope that some others of you have some input.

Good Stuff!

;~)

Just thinking out loud here. I would like to bounce some questions and concepts off of the membership. The subject is, for lack of a better definition, a purpose-built pump carrier.

It is funny how things work out. I pumped concrete in Texas for several years and was always amazed at the lack of a consistent policy on the part of the state as to what constituted an “off road vehicle.” In some states these are called S.M.E. [SPECIAL MOBILE EQUIPMENT] plates. These are treated differently than a regular truck that makes money by hauling loads, on the highway, as a source of income. Concrete pumps do not do this. Concrete pumps are, like cranes, paid for what they do ‘on the job, and do not transport material for profit. Some Texas jurisdictions recognized this difference, some did not. When I asked a person of responsible authority why he would not recognize the difference his answer was, “cranes are not mounted on Mack trucks.”

If the concrete pumping industry had a purpose built cab and chassis would this bring an end to this unfair treatment? I don’t know.

There is also an issue of excise tax on pump purchases. Would this aid or detract the argument on the part of all the [other than Schwing] owners? I don’t know.

Emissions limitations are treated differently on ‘off road’ vehicles than they are on generally regulated road trucks. Could a change to a true purpose built cab and chassis keep us from suffering the big Mack attacks on our trucks? Would we not need to hit the conflagration button and hope that it worked? A wise man once told me to prevent the preventable problems. If it was possible to prevent your engine from shutting down on the way to, during a pour or on the way home; that would be a good problem to prevent.

I would guess that the CPMA [concrete pump manufactures association] has the drawings and specifications for the ‘perfect cab and chassis’ either partially complete or all the way completed. They have wish lists too. Wouldn’t it be nice to know that the frame on your pump carrier was rigid enough so as not to flex and release the outrigger stop/lock when you drove over the curb area on the way off of a job? It would be sweet to have all of the pump wiring integrated into the chassis, and not have a bundle of unneeded wires and such in the way when the pumps are mounted. And yes, perhaps the inside of the cab overhead would not be cardboard. And, OH MY GOD: what if it had a specified place to mount the remote receiver, and… dare I say it, a cup holder or two?

And when you called for parts, EVERYONE would know that you wanted them yesterday.

I am sure not a tax lawyer or judge, but I think so. And isn't the pumping industry old enough to have its own 'car'?

Bob, in answer to your earlier question, as mentioned in another post, Cummins has met the emssions targets successfully without issues (although Mack is quick to throw stones at their approach - see their web site and chat thread on new emissions).

Caterpillar however has formed an exclusive deal with Navistar to supply engines only to them beyond 2010. In reality that means about the 9th month of 2009 will be the cut off point to order trucks with Cat power.

A purpose built chassis sure sounds good from the standpoint of moving beyond working with iron that "almost fits", & must have significant tweaking in order to work with pumps.

Lorne

LW

The pump is the reason all the end users get paid, not the truck. The carrier SHOULD be made with the pump in mind, not in spite of it. I am with you.

This project would be something I'd love to be involved with, at the present time however, and as Todd mentioned - Autocar is presenting a quality product that stands ready to provide reliable, "run when you need it" operation. What is required is a company open to the notion of "just pumping concrete when you want it", and someone who just isn't interested in service challenges and tow bills. I kind of figure that may relate a bit in this industry?

The correct sponsor will take care of US.

We need a non commercially branded carrier. When you go to get your SME plates and they ask, "What brand of truck is that?" you need to be able to whip out the paperwork that says it is a

Schwing or an Alliance or whatever it is; not an Autocar [as such]

Someone will need to make it; why not Autocar?

It needs to look like a pump carrier, not a commercial truck.

Check out that orange crane above; now picture it with a 65meter mounted on it.

On the front it needs to say :

I AM A COMPLETE UNIT - I am not a piece of equipment bolted to a truck.

You have OSHKOSH in USA , they could build a carrier for pumps....

Allwheeldrive , allwheel steering ! I want one to a 52 m !

Open letter to Chris Hotz

Chris,

First of all: If you wish to communicate with me you may do so directly:

Bob Sanderson

IRBSJR@MSN.COM

(770) 403-1444

I think that it is somewhat strange to communicate through a proxy. Since this is the way that you wish to communicate, so be it.

This letter is in response to your email to me, via Todd. First of all I believe that Schwing customers have, to this point been excluded from any past tax liability. That cuts down the ‘class’ somewhat, but I do see your point.

My making a case for a dedicated pump cab and chassis is to in the most part stop the unwarranted collection of excise tax on a vehicle that clearly does not fit the description as applicable to that taxing. I am well aware of the intense effort needed to meld a truck into a pump carrier. I have participated in the effort many times. I cannot help but feel that the efforts of those concerned will end in a complete vindication of your point of view. As happens, the government is in error.

As to the custom designed pump carrier; no one would ever suggest using a crane carrier. Please re-read my material. We are heavy enough as it is and do not need the additional counterweight mass.

As far as my purported statement that a pump is bolted to the truck. That is their contention. We flirt with that perception by the use of commercially available trucks. My entire point is to completely rid the industry of that misconception by not only being a dedicated chassis [as we now have] but by looking different than your average commercial truck. As you are I am sure finding out; perception is reality to the uninitiated.

As to your cost estimate. All that I can say is that you are greatly in error; or you were pricing a crane chassis.

Lastly, I think that it would make more sense to communicate directly, as this is a bit odd. My contact information may be found in the body of this letter.

Bob Sanderson

I agree 100% we should have a carrier not a truck mounted machine the truck fitted to the machine not machine made to fit truck

hey bob

where do you think mack get the technology for the engine controls. same reason ford bought volvo cars is the reserch and devolopment.

lets see what volvo owns. geal tractor, duetz diesel, volvo truck, volvo bus, renault truck, nissan truck, penta boat motors, air craft engines are GE, pratt & whitnet and rolls royce.

yea they are really good at fixing recalls but that does not do much for going down on the way to job.

eugene

I am sorry. I cannot make out what you are trying to say.

Maybe that VOLVO is a good brand ? I don´t know if VOLVO would build a special carrier for a pump....

Maybe TERBERG who buy engiens and cabs from VOLVO , they build the chassi for Schwings first 52m (I´am maybe wrong about that)

OSHKOSH , TERBERG , GINAF and TITAN build great chassis... And with a cab that look like a cranecab....

Thanks Vasa,

I agree that Volvo is a good company. It would be nice if our dedicated pump carrier cab came from a company like Volvo.

I had a '91 32m on a Volvo back in the mid 90's.  I worked for Jayhawk at the time.  More room than an MR, and a much shorter wheel base.  Over all from what I remember about it it was a pretty decient rig.

Your problems with your new Mack are very similar to mine. I bought a new 2009 Mack 39 meter schwing boom pump to comply with the new emissions laws in California. It's been a complete nightmare since before delivery. It was a week late on delivery because it broke down twice on the way from Minnesota to California. Once it got here it's broke down an average of once a month. Every time it goes to the Mack dealer it's in an average of two days. The Mack dealer is just as frustrated as I am. They have replaced several parts and every time they say , we finally got. It's an intermittent problem. From reading other stories online, it seems Mack has not perfected the new emissions trucks. My 2009 Peterbilt has double the hours and has not had a problem.

PLEASE!!!! Don't start building special trucks for pumps. That a realy stupid idea.. Use a proofen formula.. Take a VOLVO, MAN, SCANIA or MERCEDES.. Perfect combination and service points all around the globe.. Loads of spare parts available, Constanr development etc etc.. How can you ever think that a completely new brand only build for those ''few'' pumps can beat that.. 

That is why in europe they build small cranes on a truck chassis lol.

B.t.w. http://www.spieringskranen.nl/ buildt there carier whit only http://www.daf.com/EN/Pages/Homepage-DAF-Trucks-NV.aspx components; So they can sell world wide the dealers are already there.

Yes.. And how great these cranes look..... Than i'd almost rather have a MACK...   Square sardineboxes..