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The gap between putzmeister and the rest of the world is getting closer thanks to new stupid ugly designs. Why not complicate a straight delivery line with a whole lot of extra bends (schwing style). Why Why Why?

That is a good looking Pump

I agree. Make it more simple like schwing

It´s funny that they make a notice of "less then 32 tons", and have it mounted on a 3 axle-chassie. Most of Europes countries - include germany (!) has a weight-limit of 32 tons!....BUT only on 4-axle trucks. 3-axle truck, as their comercialtruck, has a wheightlimit on 26 tons - exactly as the wheightlimit as we have in Sweden! But every 36 m is mounted on 3 axle-chassie in Sweden, sins it was invented. Our and germans weightlimits can easily manage that.

My question is: Why tell in a comercial: "less then 32 tons", when it gives them more to say: less then 26 tons, as the maximumweight of our 3-axle trucks - if it has airsuspension. A parabelsuspension truck is only allowed to weigh: 25 tons. It means oldtechnologytrucks like: "Raba - trucks" or stoneagetechnologytrucks like: "Mack".

Do a Macktruck has an airbreaksystem or totaly hydraulic system? Or electric windowlift? or hydraulic steeringweel? or a right/left-turn-stick beside the steeringweel, or highbeamlights and windscreen as an original option.

A Scania or Volvotruck, has allways more then what ever driver ever can demand or suggest

love that paint job.

Alima, I think the M36 brochure used some copy and paste from the M42 brochure.

Anyway, some talk is, the direction the concrete pump manufacturers are moving into is putting a life cycle time limit on the machine and then expect consumers to throw them away (scrap metal). i.e Throw away generation.

So dont expect these machines to be running around in 30 years like some old thomsens do today!

I agree with you totaly 10 years will be lucky. Design is on the wrong path.

The 36m never had any weight issues.

Sick of all the fuss about weight reduction. Very disapointed, the pipe line makes me vomit whats with all the bends???

Love to see this thing go thrugh the muddy paddocks a few times.

Think its time to go back to the days of making real machines not these pretty toys.

Totaly agree they are on the wrong path.. So much BS options on these new pumps but the simple basic problems are not dealth with. For example on our new schwing 20m there is this insane system to empty and flush the waterbox.. Must have cost a lot with all these coplings and cranes and everything but wow.. Now you can clean tyhe waterbox without opening the lock. Something that is not even good because it was always good to open the waterbox and have a look inside to see how things are going in there. Now with all the stiff hoses and heavy sh't on the lock its much more a pain to open the damm lock then it was before..

But on that same lock they use some rubber that will fall off just by looking at it.. Just like 6 years ago.

 And have you seen the toolbox?? That is so imbarasing that I would opt for not suplying the customer with any tools at all. That would look better that this rubbish..

I wonder what kind of wizzkids they have behind their drawingtables but they for sure have no idea about concretepumping in the real world.. Only thing good on these new pumps are all the parts designed decades ago by a whole different generation.. 

If I would have to choosee it would be Schwing that is the least bad with all this BS.. Putz are realy getting out of hand with all the gadgets.. My slogan is always:

WORK... DON'T PLAY !!  I hope we can go back to that time again...

Hi Dipstick,  cant agree with you more. They should come out in the concrete with us a little

All we want to do is press the pump on button and pump our concrete.

We dont need more computers and complications,(oss ergonic B.S B.S ) common sense always prevails.

Heres how they  use to make tough machines out of real steel.

Take care out there.....

OLD SCHOOL 

The reality is based on recent market trends, the new m36 will be lucky to make EVEN a quarter of the money some old timers made for their owners.

Something to ponder

Have any of you had a loved one in your family that has been saved a severe injury or death by Airbags or antilock brakes?

I also started to think the improvements to machines in ALL fields not just pumping, Look at a modern farm tractor with AC and GPS, and yes concrete pumps, but it is human nature to grow and improve. How long has it been since you have had to mess around with a Choke on an old car with a carburetor ? and I am not talking about Hobbies and sport for fun but daily drivers and trucks? Some of you might not even know what a choke is……  hear is a good one Pull over on the side of the road in the rain to adjust breaker  points…..

We have evolved in industry and a lot of the growth has been for the better I think most would agree.

The pumps have been the same, Driven to keep up with the human need to grow and improve, look at the things that help improve the safety in the industry.

Yes the booms are longer lighter and more flexible but this is also stronger and as a boom inspector I find LESS cracks and problems with new generation booms than old ones in similar age group. For instance a 3 year old unit of old style and new style, the new style will have less cracks, on average.

How many of you guys want to go back to Black and white cable Remotes????? I was one of the guys that whined about these new radio Pieces of #$@% when they came out. And now I can’t even get some of you guys to use a cable remote to troubleshoot a pump.  Now with the growth you can even see the pressure and temp of the unit on some, that would have been nice years ago when I ran pump’s.

So as an “old timer” I do agree some times they can go overboard on things but most will have to take a pause and think do you seriously want to go backwards.

I like that my daughter has Airbags……….

I just had to jump in.

I love You Traveltech ! I dont want to operate some old Scheele with B&W.... I have done that , I want the top of the line . A wheelbarrow and showels are reliable to pour concrete with... And to the operators that dont want all BS , tell the owner of the Company that You want cheaper pump . And start to learn every "tool" You have on the remote and cabinet . I love the new Putz 42-5 , a dream to operate . I hope I get the new 56-5 from Putz when they change My old 46-5....

I am delivering my first 42-5 to a customer this week, yes it is new and I look forward to learning more about it.

It sure looks diferent, it is the one at the show you saw, but I think a lot of the changes will prove themselfs.

Forward.......

We have had it for testpumping... Verry nice pump ! How much is the weight between the .16HLS and the .20 cell ?

Alan,

What's with the cross over on the B section? They didn't last long on the roll and fold and this version appears to be more severe. The Z boom with standard elbows and no cross over was an improvement for pipe life.

This is new and I have not seen it in the US yet, so I cant coment on it untill I have some experiance with it.

PLENTY OF PROFIT

NEVER LET YOU DOWN PRIDE OF THE FLEET

TOO WAR AND BACK.

THESE DAYS MACHINES BUILT TOO A BUDGET & FOR AFTER SERVICE  DIAGONOSTIC DOCTORS  HANDS IN POCKETS $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

VERY HARD TO TURN A PROFIT.

HI PUMBO

I agree with you all the way 100%. I love my Putzys thats why I am also  so passionate.

You have hit all the most important points there.

The price reduction topic is more than well said, its what all us owner operators are concerned with from day one.

WELL WRITTEN TAKE IT EASY OUT THERE.

THESE THIGS BUT TO THE TEST DAY IN DAY OUT..................................

I agree with you Traveltech.. A lot of developements are good indeed.. But I hate it when they go ''overboard'' on stuff and sometimes these new developement are actualy steps backwards.. I also hate the attitute of some manf. that think they know it all better and see themselves as heroes of the industry without listening to operators...

WHEN MACHINES YOU USE TOO HAVE BALLS OF STEEL..............................................

No company will ever own 100% of any market. If PM would have lowered their prices or concentrated on price reductions instead of innovation, they would have simply lowered the value of their brand. It would have done nothing to keep them from selling to the Chinese except possibly lowering the selling price.

If pump design didn't progress we would be running (and working on) Thomsens or Yeagers or Whitemans or some other antique that was always broke down. On the plus side operators would know how to fix pumps, many don't now.

In America, when Schwing had well over 90% market share, if they continued to develop their product line it would have been harder for PM to build what they did.

I'm convinced that this "new generation" is a lot more fragile than the old one.
Maybe in Germany the roads (mainly rural) are like plates, but in east Europe aren't.

Its very simpel to say we have to keep developing. I totaly agree but what we should NOT do is develope just because we want to develope something new no mater what... It has to make sense... It has to be an improvement.. Not a pain in the *ss... It has to be like you think O my god how great that they spend all these milions on developement.. My life has become so much better now... (like for example the proportional steering)

I see a lot of things on new pumps.. Specialy putz where I don't think that.. Most times I'm not even sure if things actualy are an improvement or just plain irritating... In that case its better to just let it be and give the customer some nice discount instead...

Like for example the new 42 putz.. All this new hocus pocus.. Its like a circus atraction.. But did anyone over there ever think about that we would like to have some space on the truck for hoses, pipes and so on?? The space on top of the truck is so uneconomicly used that its almost impossible to move around. While when you look at a 40m Concord you can organise a house party on the deck and still have space for your hoses. And the footprint of that pump is so much less that you almost get the same netto reach as the 42 putz..

For me its a clear choise..

a pic

okay, so its been 4 years since this post how are you guys finding the new generation of pumps from Putzmeister?

pieces of shit imo.

booms are shit at high volume.  shitty stroke for the hose man.  too much computer.  piece of shit remotes. placement of component look like a real treat to work at.  recall on towers(for a manufure whos been around this long, thats BS!!!!)  cant see how theres not going to be more structural issue for places where the roads are rough and long cold winters.

the pump kit it shelf still seems putz strong and hammers out the mud pretty good.

they are concrete pumps that live hard lives and need to be built for a hard life like they used to be.

will add that ive only been under the 31, 36z, 38-5, 42-4, 42-5 and opertrated a 36z, 38-5, 42-4 and 42-5.  the best all-around boom was the old style 42-4.

Woow , thanks for your honesty shortstik . Looks like you have

been on most of the new generation very intresting .....

I think they are having a lot of problems its a crying shame the path we are going down .

Such a great company world leaders .

Light weight , time will tell...

The Putzmeister engineers are under assumption all their pump operators holding a university degree of some sort and thats the reality of the times we live in.

There is so much information being thrown at us we can often get lost in it. I dont believe the newer designed pumps are better for what they are worth, however i do believe they relate much better to your 21st century type operator. 

As modern day 21st century people we have become unimpressed by the simple things we can get right but moreso impressed about the things we are not quite sure about.

It also seems we are much more tolerant with unecessary change.

Come on guys seriuosly.  I can vividly recall other manufacturers that changed boom styles controls etc. with way less whining and complaining.  Jeeez there was one model that didnt even get recalled until 3 men were killed underneath one.  Whether its a Toyota or a pump there will always be issues and recalls.  Remember the Ford Pinto you didn't want to sit in the back seat of that baby.

Are there things on the new putz i would change , absolutely, Number one would be put the agitator and water pump back where they were. not on the remote.  The new boom designs and complaining about crossover pipes, 42 schwings had them forever for christ sakes. High volume pumping how fast are you pumping?  The newer machines to me seem no different.  If you are jamming a 4 inch slump through at 120 metres per hour then guess what you are going to get boom bounce and someones expectations are way to high.  Let alone beating on a machine that doesn't deserve that treatment. 

As for the new remotes with to much info how many people here before they start could do the math to figure out strokes per minute needed to keep up with redi-mix supply.  How many have used a nomograph that is part of what the new remotes help you out with.  A pour will always have to be tweaked due to so many different variables at a pour. And to me it is nice to see how hot, strokes per minute, volume, pressure etc.  Schwing has had this for years. 

In the end having an open mind towards new technology will make us all better operators, life is not going to change so how about reporting any little tricks to make them purr instead of talking about the old glory days.

By the way one of my passions is restoring antique farm equipment.  I love the old stuff.

my issue is the new pumps are make new oportors bad.  relying too much on tech and not their god give brain.  ur right, schwing has had a screen on their romote since i started pump.  it gave info to an op  thats needed, not 6 more screens of useless on the job info.  most problems ive had on site are electrical, so why would i want more?

as for volume/stroke per min, maybe people should learn basic math and equasions.  and unless the pump is ownd by the batch plant, u get what u get per/hr

we pump as hard as the job deems.  shy of the workers, very few people are paid by the hour in concrete where ive worked.  the flat work outfits and contractors want that mud down fast.  ive pumped and seen others pump 100/hr of 4inch slump no prob out of the boom.  not sure what ur saying about cross over pipes, seen them and dont see how they have any bearing on pumping, just plugs.  though if ur pluging in boom pipe, that seems more of an oparator issue then a pumping issue.

i was not around for the old glory days and after talking with old timers, it didn't seem all that glorious.  i have no prob with change.  no problem tring new tech.  i have a problem with paying 10s of thousand dollars more for useless tech.  i have a problem with tech making more lazy and stupid operators.  JMO

Well in the past I have seen and heard operators take out hyd pumps due to overheating and over reving.  Listened to machines sit there and run oil over relief because operator does not recongnize sound of machine when plugged. I wish I still had the pictures of a placing boom that literally had boom brackets broken off because of trying to ram a plug through.  Stupid is stupid tech or no tech.  

In the past year I have operated and trained people on everything from a 1973 schwing to a 2015 56 Putz.  In fact there are larger outfits out there that won't even run the older machines because the operators think they need to run newer equipment with the new technology.  

All I am asking is to be objective, all equipment has had its issues with poor engineering or manufacturing, and whether you agree or not it will happen again and I hope everyone is just as hard on them as the trash talk here.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion I get a little riled up when I can look back at my carreer and remember recalls on guide levers on 28 metres turrets on 31 cylinders on 42's guide levers on 52's outrigger on 32's etc. And then all of a sudden a company has a problem and they are a piece of s#$t.  Thhe newer companies have had their fair share of issues as well and it is forgiven because they are new.  Come on most of the designs came from putz and they still had issues, oh yeah they were 10's of thousands cheaper but that makes it okay.  Not saying I agree with all the changes but please don't blame the machine for bad operators.

guys in this generation the operators will  and are a lot more computer literate than most were back in the day , electronics and new technology I personally have no problem with , it breaks we fix it . My biggest concern is the way these pumps are being made light as possible , when we spend 500k and up on concrete pumps you like to think you are making a investment that will return your money for many years to come , that if you keep it maintenanced and do proper boom inspections etc. , that this equipment will last 10-20 years , now I cannot say for sure , but I just do not see one of these manufacturers equipment being made with this purpose in mind , all of the manufacturers I deal with think they are on the righteous path , but honestly I only see one that is sticking to making equipment that will last a lifetime.

Wow all this bad vibes out there. Wjen it comes to safty im all for it but as we all know they dont just put a sticker or change a system just because they are trying to make our jobs harder. Its because some one didnt use common sence. Or they werent trained properly. Or just got complacent. And with any design change there will be recalls and flaws. But the new tower design isnt that new been used for years by other manufacturers. As for the controles for those of you who dont like them try the old danfoss valves or better yet lets all go back to the good old golden flapper.. We as operators should strive to be the best and maintain a professionalism. As times change so do we. A lot of you dont remember the 400yard pours that took 15hours had to change shift springs,sometimes had to change out a 1 1/4valve,or even a sundstrand. We yes the change is hard on me but I embrace the changes if it helps the new operators and helps save lifes even if it means we need to change the way we do things im all for it. So sweet and simple. We arnt in the 1970s anymore times change so should we. Yes it aucks at times but the probably said the same thing about the invention of the refrigerator.. 

The refrrigerator was pretty cool back then and still pretty cool today.

Ok. After all the discussions about the futures and electronics on the remotes what don’t need to be on the remote and all other things.

A case study.

Is it safe that you lose control over your boom if the machine gets out of level.

You are a very experienced operator and you notice your machine is sinking in the ground and you know it is bad. But before you can react and swing away from the crew the safety system shut of your controls.        

I'm afraid you are only a passenger to the machine in regards to your case study. The EU safety directives give a safety requirement and manufacturer follows. Safety is an aspect of life that once its implemented if it is tampered with results in heavy prosecution - no-one would dare reverse engineer a safety component no matter how fundamentally flawed it may seem.

its easy to guess.....this "new" model is simply a sany/putz hybrid....slowly sany is beginning to put is own model on the market.....they have fail 10 years ago...this time with the putz name on their boom it will be more easy to them on the marketing side....

no thanks for me......

I Am sorry ZXAZXA. But do you know where you are talking about.

This is a pump designed long before Sany took over Putzmiester.

And by the way owned by chine's or not it is still marked  as build in Germany.

putz now is a sany owned compagny!!   of course they have take the technology...but its simply a sany/putz hybrid...

they look near identical on many point on some model...they share the same turret on some model too

yup still market build in germany.....a simple BS marketing!!      

It's a touchy subject this one. I have an ambiguous answer for you and up to you to choose the interpretation of what I'm saying.

Germany industrial trade unions, due to higher wage and employment condition demands, have really squeezed manufacturing in Germany. If you want a fully Made in Germany item of any kind, TV, washing machine, vacuum cleaner, car, truck, concrete pump etc, be prepared to be paying double the worldwide market price. Possibly more.

Based on what I just wrote, In a economically crunched financial era we're living in - where profits and business survival are everything -  ask yourself how many of your bosses would be prepared to pay significant overs for a 'fully' German manufactured machine compared to a copy that does the same job?

and...as a footnote, If you shell out the coin to buy the Made In Germany item, take some time and scratch the surface, you may be surprised on what's inside.

Foremost, I have to say do not buy Putzmeister because the pump is "Made in Germany". Buy Putzmeister because of the network of people behind Putzmeister, clients, bosses, service technicians, fans, your local salesman, the best people worldwide to have at your disposal precisely when you need them. No gimmicks just good old fashioned values. And... that is something the chinese and Koreans will never be able to offer and support with any of their products. The people make Putzmeister. If you ask me, the rest are just nuts and bolts.